{"@context":"http://iiif.io/api/presentation/3/context.json","id":"https://fortworthmuseumofscienceandhistory.aviaryplatform.com/iiif/db7vm44z8c/manifest","type":"Manifest","label":{"en":["Dr. Louis Jacobs"]},"logo":"https://d9jk7wjtjpu5g.cloudfront.net/organizations/logo_images/000/000/713/original/aviary_default_logo.png?1751992923","metadata":[{"label":{"en":["Preferred Citation"]},"value":{"en":["\u003cp\u003eJacobs, Louis. Interview by Christina Hardman. \u003cem\u003ePaluxysaurus jonesi\u003c/em\u003e. August 7, 2025. Paleontological Oral History Program/Fort Worth Museum of Science and History. Fort Worth, Texas.\u003c/p\u003e"]}},{"label":{"en":["Duration"]},"value":{"en":["00:38:01"]}},{"label":{"en":["Publisher"]},"value":{"en":["Fort Worth Museum of Science and History"]}},{"label":{"en":["Agent"]},"value":{"en":["Dr. Louis Jacobs (Interviewee)"]}},{"label":{"en":["Date"]},"value":{"en":["2025-08-07 (created)"]}},{"label":{"en":["Language"]},"value":{"en":["English (primary)"]}},{"label":{"en":["Description"]},"value":{"en":["\u003cp\u003eProfessor Emeritus at SMU's Department of Earth Sciences. Dr. Jacobs is an expert in Earth Sciences and paleontology. In this interview, he recounts his work on dinosaur tracks, fossil insects, and small mammals, as well as his involvement in major paleontological discoveries and excavations in locations such as Cameroon, Pakistan, Texas, Angola, Malawi, and Mongolia. Jacobs also reflects on his time spent at the Jones Ranch site excavating \u003cem\u003ePaluxysaurus jonesi\u003c/em\u003e.\u003c/p\u003e"]}},{"label":{"en":["Format"]},"value":{"en":["MP4"]}},{"label":{"en":["Identifier"]},"value":{"en":["FWMSHPOHLJ001 (other)"]}}],"summary":{"en":["\u003cp\u003eProfessor Emeritus at SMU's Department of Earth Sciences. Dr. Jacobs is an expert in Earth Sciences and paleontology. In this interview, he recounts his work on dinosaur tracks, fossil insects, and small mammals, as well as his involvement in major paleontological discoveries and excavations in locations such as Cameroon, Pakistan, Texas, Angola, Malawi, and Mongolia. Jacobs also reflects on his time spent at the Jones Ranch site excavating \u003cem\u003ePaluxysaurus jonesi\u003c/em\u003e.\u003c/p\u003e"]},"provider":[{"id":"https://fortworthmuseumofscienceandhistory.aviaryplatform.com/aboutus","type":"Agent","label":{"en":["Fort Worth Museum of Science and History"]},"homepage":[{"id":"https://fortworthmuseumofscienceandhistory.aviaryplatform.com/","type":"Text","label":{"en":["Fort Worth Museum of Science and History"]},"format":"text/html"}],"logo":[{"id":"https://d9jk7wjtjpu5g.cloudfront.net/organizations/logo_images/000/000/713/original/aviary_default_logo.png?1751992923","type":"Image"}]}],"thumbnail":[{"id":"https://d9jk7wjtjpu5g.cloudfront.net/collection_resource_files/thumbnails/000/304/655/small/data?1773423617","type":"Image","format":"image/jpeg"}],"items":[{"id":"https://fortworthmuseumofscienceandhistory.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3545/collection_resources/167477/file/304655","type":"Canvas","label":{"en":["Media File 1 of 1 - FWMSH Paleontological Oral History Program: Dr. Louis Jacobs"]},"duration":2281.0,"width":640,"height":360,"thumbnail":[{"id":"https://d9jk7wjtjpu5g.cloudfront.net/collection_resource_files/thumbnails/000/304/655/small/data?1773423617","type":"Image","format":"image/jpeg"}],"items":[{"id":"https://fortworthmuseumofscienceandhistory.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3545/collection_resources/167477/file/304655/content/1","type":"AnnotationPage","items":[{"id":"https://fortworthmuseumofscienceandhistory.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3545/collection_resources/167477/file/304655/content/1/annotation/1","type":"Annotation","motivation":"painting","body":{"id":"https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4VgtjYT3gac","type":"Video","format":"video/youtube","duration":2281.0,"width":640,"height":360},"target":"https://fortworthmuseumofscienceandhistory.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3545/collection_resources/167477/file/304655","metadata":[]}]}],"annotations":[{"id":"https://fortworthmuseumofscienceandhistory.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3545/collection_resources/167477/file/304655/transcript/92296","type":"AnnotationPage","label":{"en":["Dr. Louis Jacobs [Transcript]"]},"items":[{"id":"https://fortworthmuseumofscienceandhistory.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3545/collection_resources/167477/file/304655/transcript/92296/annotation/1","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"AVIARY TRANSCRIPT\r\n\r\nTRANSCRIPTION BEGINS","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fortworthmuseumofscienceandhistory.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3545/collection_resources/167477/file/304655#t=0.0,3600.0"},{"id":"https://fortworthmuseumofscienceandhistory.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3545/collection_resources/167477/file/304655/transcript/92296/annotation/2","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Introduction: The Fort Worth Museum of Science and History, Fort Worth Texas. An interview with Dr. Louis Jacobs, August 7, 2025. Paleontological Oral History Program.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fortworthmuseumofscienceandhistory.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3545/collection_resources/167477/file/304655#t=3600.0,3608.0"},{"id":"https://fortworthmuseumofscienceandhistory.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3545/collection_resources/167477/file/304655/transcript/92296/annotation/3","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Louis Jacobs: My name is Louis Jacobs. I'm a Professor Emeritus of Earth Sciences at Southern Methodist University. We've been there about 40 years, and we're moving up to Minnesota to be with our grandkids.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fortworthmuseumofscienceandhistory.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3545/collection_resources/167477/file/304655#t=3608.0,3627.0"},{"id":"https://fortworthmuseumofscienceandhistory.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3545/collection_resources/167477/file/304655/transcript/92296/annotation/4","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Interviewer: Although you retired from SMU, have you continued to work on any projects?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fortworthmuseumofscienceandhistory.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3545/collection_resources/167477/file/304655#t=3627.0,3636.0"},{"id":"https://fortworthmuseumofscienceandhistory.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3545/collection_resources/167477/file/304655/transcript/92296/annotation/5","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Louis Jacobs: Well, interestingly enough, I was working on some dinosaur tracks and what they mean to the split of African/South American formation of the South Atlantic using data that we collected in 1998. This was from Cameroon and we found in Cameroon a fossil insect pupae or chambers that would hold them, which is very interesting, and so I'm fiddling with those now, and it's just amazing. I had forgotten, but we had done data to study the stable isotope for environmental conditions. We had sampled them, but never completed the study, and part of that sample, Bonnie found one in her office from when she looked at it for me way back then. So that's one thing. The other thing is we've done a lot of work with fossil mice and I'm working with my former student who is, what she does is she vaporizes the enamel on their teeth so that she can get the isotopic composition to figure out what they ate. But it turns out that teeth start forming when the baby mice are still in the mother, and so they're not forming under a diet that they've eaten themselves. And then when they're born, they nurse and they have milk in their diet. And then once they're an adult, they have a different diet. So, that is three ways right there where you can get different numbers when you're trying to find out the same thing. And so, she's been doing a bunch of experiments with special diets and just measuring everything along the way. So that's another thing that I'm doing. The third thing is to figure out how the shapes of teeth change with adaptation, what the genetic control is, and the developmental factors so that you can relate what you get out of the fossil record really better to how they form and why they form. Yeah, they're all applied to paleontology. And another thing we're doing, we're using the same techniques with those isotopes, studying things that have different habits, and by accident we discovered that one of the fossil mice that we had been studying actually lived subterraneously, and we didn't know that before, but when we did the isotopes and compared them to things that we know lived on the surface, we could figure out what the habit of that extinct one was underground. How they live, what they ate, what tells you more about climates and into the environment. You know, when we started working on Lone Star Dinosaurs, it was a different paleontological world. Paleontology is not a static science, and you can tell, especially when you're working with students that are anxious to find new things and new techniques, you can see how the science itself evolves. And that's one of the most exciting things about it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fortworthmuseumofscienceandhistory.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3545/collection_resources/167477/file/304655#t=3636.0,3882.0"},{"id":"https://fortworthmuseumofscienceandhistory.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3545/collection_resources/167477/file/304655/transcript/92296/annotation/6","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Interviewer: What do consider the biggest difference in the field between then and now? Is it the technology?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fortworthmuseumofscienceandhistory.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3545/collection_resources/167477/file/304655#t=3882.0,3891.0"},{"id":"https://fortworthmuseumofscienceandhistory.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3545/collection_resources/167477/file/304655/transcript/92296/annotation/7","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Louis Jacobs: It is the technology, and if you know, if you can see…If you can see smaller things more clearly in some kind of way, or if you can see anything more clearly, or you can measure it more precisely, it's the differences in precision and the windows that open up. And that's pretty broadly and widely applicable across science.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fortworthmuseumofscienceandhistory.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3545/collection_resources/167477/file/304655#t=3891.0,3933.0"},{"id":"https://fortworthmuseumofscienceandhistory.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3545/collection_resources/167477/file/304655/transcript/92296/annotation/8","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Interviewer: You are very well-known and respected in your field. Can you describe the journey that brought you here?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fortworthmuseumofscienceandhistory.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3545/collection_resources/167477/file/304655#t=3933.0,3942.0"},{"id":"https://fortworthmuseumofscienceandhistory.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3545/collection_resources/167477/file/304655/transcript/92296/annotation/9","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Louis Jacobs: When I was going to graduate school, I was interested in studying marine invertebrates, living ones, or fossil vertebrates. I ended up going to Arizona, University of Arizona, which is where Bonnie and I met, and I started out studying fossil rodents because in those days mammals were the really hot things. And by sieving, you could recover very small things and discover a lot of new stuff. So, for my masters, I worked on things that actually explained the biogeography of some of the animals that live in South America and North America. So, then, working for my Ph.D., I went back to Pakistan and did it in Pakistan, where in Pakistan the Himalaya are rising up because the Indian subcontinent slammed into Asia. And as the Himalayas grow up, they erode. And what erodes off of them covers up bones in the floodplains. And you have a very good fossil record for the whole length of time. So, the Himalaya were being uplifted. So, my role there was the small mammals starting there, and we got all kinds of things. And because rodents evolve so fast, they're good at telling time, because they change rapidly. It's not like horses, which are very good at telling time also, but there's not a lot of horses. There's a lot of individuals, but there's not a lot of different species compared to rodents. So, if you just look at the numbers, you can understand why rodents would be so good at telling geologic time. So that's what I did over there. And I think the best discovery that I made over there was the beginning of the family that includes the laboratory rats and mice. And once you know that, they're used for so many things. I knew the age of them, then we could calibrate the rate of molecular evolution by having a fixed point that showed where they started. So that was very useful. It's old now, but it still gets used, so that's good. So, from when we were there, the research group was very big and very international, and it was mainly comprised of people that were interested in human evolution. So, they were interested in evolution in Africa as well as they were in Asia. So, I left my first job at the Museum of Northern Arizona and became the head of paleontology at the National Museum of Kenya with…Richard Leakey was our boss over there. So, from that that's where I went to…that's, where I went to…after that I went, to SMU in 1983. So, I was still working in Pakistan. As a matter of fact, my students and I still work in Pakistan, but we don't go there anymore. That project has lasted 50 years and there was a volume that came out putting everything together this year, well 50 years…anyway. So, when I went to SMU, I had a friend at Tarleton, Tarleton State named Phil Murray. And I knew him because he was an expert on the Triassic of Texas and my first job was in Arizona near the Painted Desert and I had started working on the Triassic there and asked Phil to come out and work with me and so we got to be friends because he's very good and very hard worker. And so, we decided that since I was now in Texas, and he was in Texas, we’d do a project on fossils and on the Cretaceous of Texas. And right, right after we agreed to that, one of Phil's students, Rusty Branch, discovered dinosaurs at Lake Proctor, and that's where you're…you got one on display. And that was probably the richest dinosaur site ever found in Texas, Procter Lake. The New York Times came out and did an article on it. We had Nick Cotton, who was the big paleontologist at the Smithsonian at the time, he came out. Wann Langston came up to it. And that was very good. And that's actually what started me on dinosaurs, because I was a rat guy before that. And then it just kept going. There got to be more and more fossils. And it became obvious that what we had in Texas was a time, in this part of Texas, was a time that wasn't well represented elsewhere. And it had both marine oceanic deposits, and it had terrestrial deposits. So, you had an inter-tonguing of marine and non-marine. And since there weren't many radiometric dates from Texas and the marine fossils were good at telling time, you could date the dinosaurs and things because of that inter-fingering. So that made it interesting. It made good field problems. And we just started finding more and more things, more and more dinosaurs, but not just that. We were screened and we got lizards and mammals and all kinds of things that were just terrific. And that's still going on. So, we’ve had great, great success with new dinosaurs. I think we've got how many? Six new ones that our group has named dinosaurs, not other things, but just the dinosaurs. And from the marine, there's all these mosasaurs and marine lizards. And so, when we were looking for another project, we knew that the Portuguese, years ago had discovered mosasaurs in Angola, and so we went there and we just found a rich graveyard of things. So, we started working there in 2005. But that goes along with what we were learning here also, and I can tell you that the fossil record here in this part of Texas, is one of the best, most complete sections for these marine reptiles, Cretaceous marine reptiles, like Cretaceous, anywhere. So that was good. And then, because we were working in Angola and they had no, they had had war for forty years, and they had no, no memory of any fossils or anybody working on fossils or even what fossils were so it was a big problem to get…make them aware of it and of course you know anywhere you go in the world people like fossils and they get behind them if they know about them. That's why you use them in your museum. And so, we decided the best way to get Angola to notice what they had is if they saw that other people were interested in what they had. So, we put up an exhibit in the Smithsonian. It was supposed to go up for two years. We put it up in 2018 and it came down last September. So it was that much longer than that. It had over 15 million visits and the exhibit is going to travel around for three years and then everything goes back to Angola. But already, one of the Angolans we trained has been named the director of the National Museum of Natural History of Angola. So, they're starting to notice it, and we're hoping that'll work.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fortworthmuseumofscienceandhistory.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3545/collection_resources/167477/file/304655#t=3942.0,4524.0"},{"id":"https://fortworthmuseumofscienceandhistory.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3545/collection_resources/167477/file/304655/transcript/92296/annotation/10","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Interviewer: Can you talk about your time in Malawi?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fortworthmuseumofscienceandhistory.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3545/collection_resources/167477/file/304655#t=4524.0,4533.0"},{"id":"https://fortworthmuseumofscienceandhistory.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3545/collection_resources/167477/file/304655/transcript/92296/annotation/11","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Louis Jacobs: That was one of the places, from our work, when we lived in Kenya, we met a person that was visiting the museum there, whose name was Zeffi El-Fulu. And I was talking to him about things, and he told me he was from Malawi. And we started talking, and so we decided we'd work on these fossils, or fossil beds that had been studied by the British decades before then. And so, we went down there and we found a lot of stuff. And so, we worked on that, including Malawisaurus. And other things too, so it was very interesting. One of the things that we did there, we recruited an undergraduate from Chancery University in Zambia, and her name was Elizabeth Gomani and she came out in the field with us. And then the next year she came on the field with us. And the way we found her was that we had asked one of the people at the antiquities department to help us find a student, a Malawian student that was interested in what we were doing, plus had a background in math, chemistry, physics, biology, all the things that you need. And Elizabeth was that person. So, she came over and got her master's degree at SMU, specifically studying a little crocodile that we found in burrows that had teeth that were evolved convergently to look like mammal teeth. And then for a PhD, she did a detailed study of Malawisaurus and named another new dinosaur. And then she went back to her country, and she became the head of antiquities, and then the head of culture, and now she's the Secretary of National Unity for the Republic of Malawi.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fortworthmuseumofscienceandhistory.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3545/collection_resources/167477/file/304655#t=4533.0,4692.0"},{"id":"https://fortworthmuseumofscienceandhistory.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3545/collection_resources/167477/file/304655/transcript/92296/annotation/12","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Interviewer: What is it like to have a dinosaur named after you?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fortworthmuseumofscienceandhistory.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3545/collection_resources/167477/file/304655#t=4692.0,4702.0"},{"id":"https://fortworthmuseumofscienceandhistory.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3545/collection_resources/167477/file/304655/transcript/92296/annotation/13","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Louis Jacobs: Corythoraptor. That was named by Lü Junchang, who got his Ph.D. with me. Actually, I've forgotten how many things I've had named after me, but Phil Murray named one. I don't know if there's nine or ten or eleven or something, but only one dinosaur, Corythoraptor. And Lü Junchang, who was Chinese, and my Korean student, whose name was Yuong-Nam Lee, and one of my Japanese students whose name was Yoshi Kobayashi. And they're all three very successful. And the way they met each other is the Korean student was here. He was the first of the three here. And then there was a Japanese…very high-level Japanese guy who was building the Fukui Dinosaur Museum. Azuma is his name, Azuma, and he came over to go to Glen Rose because Glen Rose is the first place in the world where sauropod tracks were recognized. So, I was busy teaching, so my Korean student took him to Glenrose, and Azuma said to the Korean student, I am running the Silk Road expedition with the Chinese across Western China, would you like to join? So, he went on it, and then there was the Japanese student, Yoshi Kobayashi, and the Chinese student, Lü Junchang. They all got to be friends. They all get their PhDs at SMU. They're all three authors on that paper that named Corythoraptor. And they all worked together for me in Mongolia and brought their professor over to work with them.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fortworthmuseumofscienceandhistory.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3545/collection_resources/167477/file/304655#t=4702.0,4816.0"},{"id":"https://fortworthmuseumofscienceandhistory.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3545/collection_resources/167477/file/304655/transcript/92296/annotation/14","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Interviewer: How did SMU become involved with the Paluxysaurus jonesi excavation?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fortworthmuseumofscienceandhistory.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3545/collection_resources/167477/file/304655#t=4816.0,4826.0"},{"id":"https://fortworthmuseumofscienceandhistory.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3545/collection_resources/167477/file/304655/transcript/92296/annotation/15","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Louis Jacobs: Here's how SMU got to Jones Ranch. Phil Murray was called out there by Billy Jones that owned the land. So, Bill was digging a tank, and he found some mammoth bones. And Phil went out to look at it and Mr. Jones said, “You know, I got this place on my land that the University of Texas, and Jeff Pittman had dugout there, and Langston had found bones. So, Phil Murray called me, and you know, since we were working on the Cretaceous together those days. And then, I think it was, we might have been working with the I don't know, you might have to ask Jim Diffily about this, but I think the Tenontosaurus on the Doss Ranch was brought to the Fort Worth Museum and I think Jim Diffily called me up on that. So, it all got together in that we called Jim Diffily and the Fort Worth Museum saying that we were working on this stuff. Well, I think Jim Diffily tells a story that... Somebody brought in these bones and he told me about it and I said something like, “How do you know?” Yeah, I think he was a little…he always thought that was funny.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fortworthmuseumofscienceandhistory.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3545/collection_resources/167477/file/304655#t=4826.0,4927.0"},{"id":"https://fortworthmuseumofscienceandhistory.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3545/collection_resources/167477/file/304655/transcript/92296/annotation/16","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Interviewer: What was your role in the excavation?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fortworthmuseumofscienceandhistory.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3545/collection_resources/167477/file/304655#t=4927.0,4937.0"},{"id":"https://fortworthmuseumofscienceandhistory.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3545/collection_resources/167477/file/304655/transcript/92296/annotation/17","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Louis Jacobs: The Fort Worth Museum negotiated things with with Bill Jones. Don Otto and Charlie went down there and everything. And so, we were going to do a major excavation. And I would have to say that Jim Diffily in the field was really the driving force. He was the…he's the one that kept those camps running, and it just wouldn't have been the same at all without Jim and the Fort Worth people. Dale Winkler more or less took control of the data gathering for each of the bones and all that. I would say I was more or less part of the labor force. You know, we were preparing it over at SMU, and Kent Newman was very big on that. You know what happens when Paluxysaurus dies, its flesh creates the conditions that causes rocks to crystallize around it. So, these bones were covered in huge calcareous concretions. And they had to be cut out of the ground, for one thing, for the rock saws. And they have to cut be out of rock they were stuck to using diamond blades in the lab. And most of that was done in…at SMU in the labs at SMU. But if they were too big, then you had a yard over here by the river, and we went out there and they were cut down there. That was a very long process. So, we just plowed through it, really. I think you still have some in your warehouse that's not prepared, but... It should be. It all should be prepared. So, we had to make sure that the lab kept running there. But on the whole, it was all…everybody just went out there and dug. There was a great set of volunteers that the museum put together, and they had friends…the Dallas Paleo Society supplied people. And there was no shortage, but I think one of the most important things that the Fort Worth…that the museum did in utilizing what was there and what we were doing was to set up a Lone Star Dinosaur Teacher Institute. Because…I guess for two weeks teachers from all over Texas would come here, or come down there, spend a week out in the field, then they'd come to the labs at SMU and see how the preparation was done. Then they'd come here and they'd do exercises for their classrooms. And this went on for ten years. National Science Foundation funded it through the Fort Worth Museum. I think it was the brainchild of Charlie Walter. And that's who spoke to us when we came over here for the organizational meetings and met with all those teachers. And we still are close to those teachers, you know? And we were really very, very close. So that was what I thought. And I don't know. There probably is, but I don't know. I don't know, but certainly not in Texas, because there's not another site like Jones Ranch in Texas that's known yet. So, that was put to work in a way that nothing else could be. And it was outstanding in the world in what it did in that regard.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fortworthmuseumofscienceandhistory.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3545/collection_resources/167477/file/304655#t=4937.0,5225.0"},{"id":"https://fortworthmuseumofscienceandhistory.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3545/collection_resources/167477/file/304655/transcript/92296/annotation/18","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Interviewer: And you received an award from TESTA?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fortworthmuseumofscienceandhistory.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3545/collection_resources/167477/file/304655#t=5225.0,5234.0"},{"id":"https://fortworthmuseumofscienceandhistory.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3545/collection_resources/167477/file/304655/transcript/92296/annotation/19","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Louis Jacobs: I got the Skoog Cup and basically what those teachers did, they became very big in the Texas Earth Science Teachers Association, and I used to go to their annual meetings, or whatever annual meetings they had their groups. It was just great. They were very good to work with. You know, teachers are very appreciative of just a kind word.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fortworthmuseumofscienceandhistory.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3545/collection_resources/167477/file/304655#t=5234.0,5275.0"},{"id":"https://fortworthmuseumofscienceandhistory.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3545/collection_resources/167477/file/304655/transcript/92296/annotation/20","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Interviewer: What do you recall about Bill and Decie Jones?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fortworthmuseumofscienceandhistory.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3545/collection_resources/167477/file/304655#t=5275.0,5284.0"},{"id":"https://fortworthmuseumofscienceandhistory.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3545/collection_resources/167477/file/304655/transcript/92296/annotation/21","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Louis Jacobs: Well, you know, I always got a kick out of Bill and Decie. Their house was a Sears and Roebuck mail order house. Bill was a pilot, was a commercial pilot, but in his retirement, he flew a small plane. Just going to pick up peanuts in the panhandle and taking them to the factories and that's what he did. He was very welcoming and a really nice guy. His daughter went to SMU, I think she was in the business school, but she was looking for a place to go, and it was good to be able to talk to her and I was glad she went to SMU. Decie is just a very, very sweet person. And I say that because she appreciated my jokes more than anybody else.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fortworthmuseumofscienceandhistory.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3545/collection_resources/167477/file/304655#t=5284.0,5365.0"},{"id":"https://fortworthmuseumofscienceandhistory.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3545/collection_resources/167477/file/304655/transcript/92296/annotation/22","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Interviewer: The Jones family seemed exceptionally dedicated to ensuring the fossils benefitted the public.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fortworthmuseumofscienceandhistory.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3545/collection_resources/167477/file/304655#t=5365.0,5374.0"},{"id":"https://fortworthmuseumofscienceandhistory.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3545/collection_resources/167477/file/304655/transcript/92296/annotation/23","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Louis Jacobs: Well, it meant a great deal to them. They liked the fact that it was going to a museum. They loved the fact the Lone Star Dinosaur Institute teachers were there. Every time, Bill would go down to the campfire one night with all the teachers, and he'd I started talking about how important...[tearing up] We used to laugh at Bill for this. But anyway, he'd start talking about how teachers were so important. And then he'd start crying. And we'd make fun of him the rest of the night. But it was very touching.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fortworthmuseumofscienceandhistory.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3545/collection_resources/167477/file/304655#t=5374.0,5442.0"},{"id":"https://fortworthmuseumofscienceandhistory.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3545/collection_resources/167477/file/304655/transcript/92296/annotation/24","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Interviewer: What was so special about Jones Ranch compared to other excavation sites?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fortworthmuseumofscienceandhistory.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3545/collection_resources/167477/file/304655#t=5442.0,5451.0"},{"id":"https://fortworthmuseumofscienceandhistory.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3545/collection_resources/167477/file/304655/transcript/92296/annotation/25","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Louis Jacobs: The concentration of bones in the setting…there wasn't another one…There's not another locality like it that I know of in Texas. And its age is important. And, you know, it was known. It was known by University of California I think even before Langston, I'm not sure. But Don Savage had been there. And so it was known, but it was difficult, and you know, my understanding from Langston was that Pittman, when he was a student at UT, he and some other guys went out there and found these bones again, rediscovered them, and Wann Langston called up Mr. Jones and said, “Mr. Jones, I have some students up in your neck of the woods. And they crossed your fence and they found some dinosaur bones.” He said, “I'm sorry about that, but can we dig them?” And Mr. Jones said yes. And that's when Pittman went there, and Pittman took a few bones out. But it was hard, and it was hot, and he was alone. So, it was more than one person could do. And, as a matter of fact, had it not been the association of Fort Worth Museum and  - Don Otto and Charlie Walters, they were very much for it - and then SMU and that association and being able to put the time in for a decade or two and being to be able to saw all that rock off, that made it work. And that's just Yeah, it's just, a perfect storm.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fortworthmuseumofscienceandhistory.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3545/collection_resources/167477/file/304655#t=5451.0,5576.0"},{"id":"https://fortworthmuseumofscienceandhistory.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3545/collection_resources/167477/file/304655/transcript/92296/annotation/26","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Interviewer: What were your thoughts when it was suggested that this was a completely new species of dinosaur?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fortworthmuseumofscienceandhistory.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3545/collection_resources/167477/file/304655#t=5576.0,5585.0"},{"id":"https://fortworthmuseumofscienceandhistory.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3545/collection_resources/167477/file/304655/transcript/92296/annotation/27","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Louis Jacobs: Well, you know, of course you like that, but really every fossil is telling you something, new or not new, and dinosaur or not dinosaur. So just the fact that we had a story that added to the body of knowledge and tells about Texas, and the teachers can use it, and all of those things made it special.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fortworthmuseumofscienceandhistory.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3545/collection_resources/167477/file/304655#t=5585.0,5627.0"},{"id":"https://fortworthmuseumofscienceandhistory.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3545/collection_resources/167477/file/304655/transcript/92296/annotation/28","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Interviewer: What was the biggest challenge to the excavation over the years?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fortworthmuseumofscienceandhistory.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3545/collection_resources/167477/file/304655#t=5627.0,5628.0"},{"id":"https://fortworthmuseumofscienceandhistory.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3545/collection_resources/167477/file/304655/transcript/92296/annotation/29","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Louis Jacobs: It was a lot of bones. You know, you have to move those, you know. So, the logistics are really complicated, and you know you got to get them into a lab and get them out of the rock and those are major challenges.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fortworthmuseumofscienceandhistory.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3545/collection_resources/167477/file/304655#t=5628.0,5645.0"},{"id":"https://fortworthmuseumofscienceandhistory.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3545/collection_resources/167477/file/304655/transcript/92296/annotation/30","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Interviewer: What would you say is the legacy or the usefulness of the Paluxysaurus excavation for the field of paleontology?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fortworthmuseumofscienceandhistory.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3545/collection_resources/167477/file/304655#t=5645.0,5654.0"},{"id":"https://fortworthmuseumofscienceandhistory.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3545/collection_resources/167477/file/304655/transcript/92296/annotation/31","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Louis Jacobs: You know, in those days, I think we named six new dinosaurs, if I remember correctly. So that's a legacy in and of itself. Nobody knew about those. So that is important. If you go look in your lobby, that's the legacy of it. If you look at the students of all of those...that were all touched by those teachers, that's a legacy. The papers that have been written about them, that all adds to it. And you know, everything goes brick by brick, and that's what this is.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fortworthmuseumofscienceandhistory.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3545/collection_resources/167477/file/304655#t=5654.0,5704.0"},{"id":"https://fortworthmuseumofscienceandhistory.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3545/collection_resources/167477/file/304655/transcript/92296/annotation/32","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Interviewer: What advice would you give to someone interested in museums, paleontology, or geology?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fortworthmuseumofscienceandhistory.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3545/collection_resources/167477/file/304655#t=5704.0,5713.0"},{"id":"https://fortworthmuseumofscienceandhistory.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3545/collection_resources/167477/file/304655/transcript/92296/annotation/33","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Louis Jacobs: I would tell them the same thing that I told Elizabeth Gomani. I would say study science and math, study biology, chemistry, physics. Whatever else I left out. But you know, it wouldn't be the same stuff that Elizabeth learned. It would be what the state of the art is now. So as somebody that wanted to do it, I would say be up to date in your science. That's if you want to be…go down the academic line. But the more you know, the more…the more diverse things you can actually apply it to, if you know it. And you don't know what kind of curveball life's going to throw. But that's what I would say for that. For someone that was strictly in the museum field, I would say just make sure you always respect the science, don't take shortcuts on the story you're trying to tell, and develop their communication skills.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fortworthmuseumofscienceandhistory.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3545/collection_resources/167477/file/304655#t=5713.0,5788.0"},{"id":"https://fortworthmuseumofscienceandhistory.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3545/collection_resources/167477/file/304655/transcript/92296/annotation/34","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Interviewer: What is your favorite memory of working on the excavation?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fortworthmuseumofscienceandhistory.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3545/collection_resources/167477/file/304655#t=5788.0,5796.0"},{"id":"https://fortworthmuseumofscienceandhistory.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3545/collection_resources/167477/file/304655/transcript/92296/annotation/35","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Louis Jacobs: That’s like choosing among your kids. I can't do that. It all comes as a package. Well, there was a lot of stuff going on, you know. It wasn't just, it wasn't just Paluxysaurus…the Doss Ranch stuff…that was a good…just everything.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fortworthmuseumofscienceandhistory.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3545/collection_resources/167477/file/304655#t=5796.0,5816.0"},{"id":"https://fortworthmuseumofscienceandhistory.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3545/collection_resources/167477/file/304655/transcript/92296/annotation/36","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Interviewer: Do you have any favorite campfire moments?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fortworthmuseumofscienceandhistory.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3545/collection_resources/167477/file/304655#t=5816.0,5828.0"},{"id":"https://fortworthmuseumofscienceandhistory.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3545/collection_resources/167477/file/304655/transcript/92296/annotation/37","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Louis Jacobs: Bill Jones crying. [laughs]","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fortworthmuseumofscienceandhistory.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3545/collection_resources/167477/file/304655#t=5828.0,5831.0"},{"id":"https://fortworthmuseumofscienceandhistory.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3545/collection_resources/167477/file/304655/transcript/92296/annotation/38","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Interviewer: Do you have any insight into how Dr. Langston learned about the site?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fortworthmuseumofscienceandhistory.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3545/collection_resources/167477/file/304655#t=5831.0,5839.0"},{"id":"https://fortworthmuseumofscienceandhistory.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3545/collection_resources/167477/file/304655/transcript/92296/annotation/39","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Louis Jacobs: Yeah, I think Berkley knew about it, but they didn't have any records. Probably some sort of field trip, you know, because the people from Berkley were here for a reason. I don't know. Well, Glenn Evans and who was the other one? There were two of those guys…that could have been Glenn Evans that might have found it. You might check, you know, those guys, Grayson Meade and... What's the other name I said? Glenn Evans. They worked for a seller to somebody down there in Austin. And they went to all kinds of places. So, they might've found it.\r\n\r\nTRANSCRIPTION ENDS","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fortworthmuseumofscienceandhistory.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3545/collection_resources/167477/file/304655#t=5839.0,2281.0"}]}]}]}